Okay, so I'm an Apple newbie, have only even seen a couple in real life,
but I'm really looking into getting one...whats the better retro
experience a IIe or a IIc? All thoughts and opinions welcome...

--- RATSoft/FIDO v09.14.95 [JetMail 1.01]
* Origin: STar Fleet HQ - Real Atari! bbs.sfhqbbs.org:5983 (21:3/171.0)

On 18 Jul 23 01:57:48 Atari8Guy wrote...

Okay, so I'm an Apple newbie, have only even seen a couple in real
life, but I'm really looking into getting one...whats the better
retro experience a IIe or a IIc? All thoughts and opinions welcome...

--- RATSoft/FIDO v09.14.95 [JetMail 1.01] * Origin: STar Fleet HQ -
Real Atari! bbs.sfhqbbs.org:5983 (21:3/171.0)

To which Commodore Clifford replies...

Some of it might depend on space considerations.... I have a //c because
it fits nicely on the desk... I also have a ][e (not on my main desk) for
the expansion ports.

Are you just going to run games/utilities, or do you really want to max
out the experience?

--- RATSoft/FIDO v09.14.95 [JetMail 1.01]
* Origin: STar Fleet HQ - Real Atari! bbs.sfhqbbs.org:5983 (21:3/171.0)

Okay, so I'm an Apple newbie, have only even seen a couple in real life, but I'm really looking into getting one...whats the better retro experience a IIe or a IIc? All thoughts and opinions welcome...

Ponder... it depends on what you're looking for....

If you want the best of all worlds, I'd say get a IIgs. It'll do everything
the IIe or c will do, and give you access to the 16bit software kicking
around specifically for that platform. Most equipment for a IIe will function in a IIgs, there are some odd exceptions where the timing on the card isn't tight enough for the GS... on the down side, you need an RGB monitot capable
of synching at 15Khz or some kind of converter for a different standard. Probably the most likely candidates will be LCD or CRT in the ~12-14" range with a SCART connector. The SCART standard will allow direct interface with
a custom cable.

Between at IIc and e... I'd probably run with a IIe.. you'll have more flexibility in just how you can set it up. The cards maketh the machine..you need to be a little careful with your IIc selection, early versions had
serial port issues, and an inability to do much more than 2400. On the plus side here all you need is a composite monitor, but Apple NTSC is weird... so some colour monitors won't cope with it well and may just drop colour. Personally I'd run with a mono green and call it done.

Spec


*** THE READER V4.50 [freeware]
--- SuperBBS v1.17-3 (Eval)
* Origin: A camel is a horse designed by a committee. (21:3/101)

Okay, so I'm an Apple newbie, have only even seen a couple in real life, but I'm really looking into getting one...whats the better retro experience a IIe or a IIc? All thoughts and opinions welcome...

I had a IIc (looks like a laptop kinda).
I wanted a IIe (it allows expansion boards to be installed).
I still have 2 books for Scale Model Trains that (being in the Circuit Board Industry) allows building boards to fit the IIe and used software (that one would have to enter the code manually to use it), to control scale model items such as: switches, lights, etc.

I have a couple "more" modern Apple iMacs that I rebuilt and installed larger hard drives in. I also picked up one of those Mac Minis (no monitor, but more tech updated) that I plug into my TV and can remote desktop to either of the iMacs for playing around.

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A48 (Windows/32)
* Origin: Files 4 Fun BBS (21:2/120)

and may just drop colour. Personally I'd run with a mono green and call
it done.

I upgraded my monoGREEN for a monoAMBER/ORANGE -- that was awesome!! LOL

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A48 (Windows/32)
* Origin: Files 4 Fun BBS (21:2/120)

Okay, so I'm an Apple newbie, have only even seen a couple in real life, but I'm really looking into getting one...whats the better retro experience a IIe or a IIc? All thoughts and opinions welcome...

I have a IIe - they are very basic, and the hardware wasn't fully baked at this point... like I dislike how the Disk ][ drives' wires just kinda pop out of the back of the computer... and they are 'hard' connected - meaning they don't unplug w/o removing the top cover. There are solutions you can add that remedy this, but its something to be aware of.

From what I'm told, if yer just wanting to get into the retro Apple scene with ONE computer, the IIgs is the way to go - as you can play most of the software from the II/IIe/IIc/IIgs lines. (I may be wrong about ALL those, but know the IIgs is a popular entry point as it is more capable than the earlier II lines..)



|07p|15AULIE|1142|07o
|08.........

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A48 (Linux/64)
* Origin: 2o fOr beeRS bbS>>20ForBeers.com:1337 (21:2/150)

I upgraded my monoGREEN for a monoAMBER/ORANGE -- that was awesome!! LOL

Phhrpt! Personally I always found the amber monitors more harsh on the eyeballs than greens... But each to his own :) Enjoy it, it's one less I'll have to look at :P

Spec


*** THE READER V4.50 [freeware]
--- SuperBBS v1.17-3 (Eval)
* Origin: A camel is a horse designed by a committee. (21:3/101)

I have a IIe - they are very basic, and the hardware wasn't fully baked at this point... like I dislike how the Disk ][ drives' wires just kinda pop out of the back of the computer... and they are 'hard' connected - meaning they don't unplug w/o removing the top cover. There are solutions you can add that remedy this, but its something to be aware of.

That'd depend largely on the age of the IIe. If you want to avoid the DiskII interface with the hard wired connections hanging out the back, you'd want to find a more recent IIe.. relatively speaking at this point.

Late beige IIes or Platinum versions with the build in keypad, will have
5.25" unidisk cards. They have the DB25 maybe its 15.. been a while since I thought about it, which have an external port and the drive plugs into that.
Or any IIe with a DuoDisk would also be in that category.

Personally I prefer the beige IIe to the Platinum version. The Platinum save having the keypad and colour doesn't have any other distinct advantages and
for my money the same realestate with the keypad jammed in was always kind of cramped. Oh and a few cards don't like the modified space available in the case. RamWorksIII is an instance, although modern alternatives would've have this problem.

Spec


*** THE READER V4.50 [freeware]
--- SuperBBS v1.17-3 (Eval)
* Origin: A camel is a horse designed by a committee. (21:3/101)

On 18 Jul 23 21:26:00 Spectre wrote...

If you want the best of all worlds, I'd say get a IIgs. It'll do
everything the IIe or c will do, and give you access to the 16bit
software kicking around specifically for that platform. Most
equipment for a IIe will function in a IIgs, there are some odd
exceptions where the timing on the card isn't tight enough for the
GS... on the down side, you need an RGB monitot capable of synching
at 15Khz or some kind of converter for a different standard. Probably
the most likely candidates will be LCD or CRT in the ~12-14" range
with a SCART connector. The SCART standard will allow direct
interface with a custom cable.

Between at IIc and e... I'd probably run with a IIe.. you'll have
more flexibility in just how you can set it up. The cards maketh the machine..you need to be a little careful with your IIc selection,
early versions had serial port issues, and an inability to do much
more than 2400. On the plus side here all you need is a composite
monitor, but Apple NTSC is weird... so some colour monitors won't
cope with it well and may just drop colour. Personally I'd run with a
mono green and call it done.

To which Commodore Clifford replies...

Well, the 15khz thing is something we Atarians know well, so he should be
good there (I've been looking into a GS myself since I already have the
//c and ][e).... But as tot he Apple NTSC and the color dropping, that's probably the artifacting that got used to squeeze some more colors out...
The Atari used that a lot too.

I remember the old days with the apple that my friend had though... When
he finally traded the old green screen for the color monitor (well, when
his parents did, we were in gradeschool) man, it made all the difference
gaming wise.

Though I have to say, somtimes I prefer the mono white that came with my
//c even though I have the green screen I got with the ][e as well and a
couple Amdeks (though those usually get attached to the Ataris).

--- RATSoft/FIDO v09.14.95 [JetMail 1.01]
* Origin: STar Fleet HQ - Real Atari! bbs.sfhqbbs.org:5983 (21:3/171.0)

On 18 Jul 23 08:22:21 SirRonmit wrote...

and may just drop colour. Personally I'd run with a mono green
and call it done.

I upgraded my monoGREEN for a monoAMBER/ORANGE -- that was awesome!!
LOL

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A48 (Windows/32) * Origin: Files 4 Fun BBS
(21:2/120)

To which Commodore Clifford replies...

I always loved the amber ones... Was that an Apple branded one, or just
one of the others?

--- RATSoft/FIDO v09.14.95 [JetMail 1.01]
* Origin: STar Fleet HQ - Real Atari! bbs.sfhqbbs.org:5983 (21:3/171.0)

I always loved the amber ones... Was that an Apple branded one, or just one of the others?

Believe it to be non-Apple .. I still have it, so I'd have to go look-see.

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A48 (Windows/32)
* Origin: Files 4 Fun BBS (21:2/120)

Well, the 15khz thing is something we Atarians know well, so he should be

Hehe, when I think Atari, I tend to think 4 and 800s....

good there (I've been looking into a GS myself since I already have the //c and ][e).... But as tot he Apple NTSC and the color dropping, that's

Way back when I had a ROM3, I'd probably give my left testicle for another
one these days. Its just that bit more refined than the ROM1.

Worst case scenario for Monitots on the Clone-E I have has been text being
ok, and nothing but a blank screen for graphics. Workaround initially was to feed it through a VCR, and later a NTSC/PAL converter didn't much matter
which way it ran it was enough to clean up the signal. Ye olde CRT doesn't have much problem, more modern LCD based pictures tend to have strife.

I remember the old days with the apple that my friend had though... When he finally traded the old green screen for the color monitor (well, when his parents did, we were in gradeschool) man, it made all the difference

For the longest time I was on Mono... school had green Monitot IIs I only had the old CCTV black and white display. By the time I hitched colour up to it,
I was a bit disappointed feeling whoever had written most software had optimised for the different textures in B&W and it looked rubbish in colour.


Spec


*** THE READER V4.50 [freeware]
--- SuperBBS v1.17-3 (Eval)
* Origin: A camel is a horse designed by a committee. (21:3/101)

Personally I think hte IIe is a better retro experience than the IIc,
IMHO.

But I had a kick-ass IIgs a few years ago that had a hard disk, a 5.25
floppy and a 3.5 floppy. I would like to have that one back...

--- RATSoft/FIDO v09.14.95 [JetMail 1.01]
* Origin: STar Fleet HQ - Real Atari! bbs.sfhqbbs.org:5983 (21:3/171.0)

But I had a kick-ass IIgs a few years ago that had a hard disk, a 5.25 floppy and a 3.5 floppy. I would like to have that one back...

At one time I had a Rom3 with Zip Card, HS SCSI, and sound card so you could have stereo. I too would like it back... if wishes were pooters we'd all have a IIgs?

ST

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A47 2021/12/24 (Linux/64)
* Origin: Storm BBS (21:2/108)

On 18 Jul 23 02:33:26 Commodore Clifford wrote...

On 18 Jul 23 01:57:48 Atari8Guy wrote...

Okay, so I'm an Apple newbie, have only even seen a couple in
real life, but I'm really looking into getting one...whats the
better retro experience a IIe or a IIc? All thoughts and
opinions welcome...

--- RATSoft/FIDO v09.14.95 [JetMail 1.01] * Origin: STar Fleet
HQ - Real Atari! bbs.sfhqbbs.org:5983 (21:3/171.0)

To which Commodore Clifford replies...

Some of it might depend on space considerations.... I have a //c
because it fits nicely on the desk... I also have a ][e (not on my
main desk) for the expansion ports.

Are you just going to run games/utilities, or do you really want to
max out the experience?

--- RATSoft/FIDO v09.14.95 [JetMail 1.01] * Origin: STar Fleet HQ -
Real Atari! bbs.sfhqbbs.org:5983 (21:3/171.0)

To which Atari8Guy replies...

Well if my Atari habit is any indcation, I'll probably start with the
former and end up at the latter. Mostly games, I'd explore the
educational stuff and check out the apps, but I don't think I'd actually
use the apps for productivity. I would like to BBS with it.

--- RATSoft/FIDO v09.14.95 [JetMail 1.01]
* Origin: STar Fleet HQ - Real Atari! bbs.sfhqbbs.org:5983 (21:3/171.0)

On 18 Jul 23 21:26:00 Spectre wrote...

Okay, so I'm an Apple newbie, have only even seen a couple in
real life, but I'm really looking into getting one...whats the
better retro experience a IIe or a IIc? All thoughts and
opinions welcome...

Ponder... it depends on what you're looking for....

If you want the best of all worlds, I'd say get a IIgs. It'll do
everything the IIe or c will do, and give you access to the 16bit
software kicking around specifically for that platform. Most
equipment for a IIe will function in a IIgs, there are some odd
exceptions where the timing on the card isn't tight enough for the
GS... on the down side, you need an RGB monitot capable of synching
at 15Khz or some kind of converter for a different standard. Probably
the most likely candidates will be LCD or CRT in the ~12-14" range
with a SCART connector. The SCART standard will allow direct
interface with a custom cable.

Between at IIc and e... I'd probably run with a IIe.. you'll have
more flexibility in just how you can set it up. The cards maketh the machine..you need to be a little careful with your IIc selection,
early versions had serial port issues, and an inability to do much
more than 2400. On the plus side here all you need is a composite
monitor, but Apple NTSC is weird... so some colour monitors won't
cope with it well and may just drop colour. Personally I'd run with a
mono green and call it done.

Spec

*** THE READER V4.50 [freeware] --- SuperBBS v1.17-3 (Eval) *
Origin: A camel is a horse designed by a committee. (21:3/101)

To which Atari8Guy replies...

Thanks for that, there is currently a IIc available locally I've been considering - about 250 canadian. I have an Apple II mono monitor and a
JVC broadcast monitor that will sync with anything it seems. Seems like
its deskspace vs customization options. I consider the IIgs but its more pricey and isn't really the experience I'm looking to capture, though on
its merits, it seems like a great machine.

--- RATSoft/FIDO v09.14.95 [JetMail 1.01]
* Origin: STar Fleet HQ - Real Atari! bbs.sfhqbbs.org:5983 (21:3/171.0)

On 19 Jul 23 23:56:46 Bf2K+ wrote...

Personally I think hte IIe is a better retro experience than the IIc,
IMHO.

But I had a kick-ass IIgs a few years ago that had a hard disk, a
5.25 floppy and a 3.5 floppy. I would like to have that one back...

--- RATSoft/FIDO v09.14.95 [JetMail 1.01] * Origin: STar Fleet HQ -
Real Atari! bbs.sfhqbbs.org:5983 (21:3/171.0)

To which Commodore Clifford replies...

Woah... an Apple guy as well? Whoda thunkit? I've got a IIgs on the
list of things to obtain after VCF Midwest. Already have the IIe and //c

--- RATSoft/FIDO v09.14.95 [JetMail 1.01]
* Origin: STar Fleet HQ - Real Atari! bbs.sfhqbbs.org:5983 (21:3/171.0)

On 22 Jul 23 10:25:54 Atari8Guy wrote...

Well if my Atari habit is any indcation, I'll probably start with the former and end up at the latter. Mostly games, I'd explore the
educational stuff and check out the apps, but I don't think I'd
actually use the apps for productivity. I would like to BBS with it.

To which Commodore Clifford replies...

I know it's an old reply... but unless space is at a horrible premium,
I'd probably go IIe then (or IIgs). The //c is nice, but there are far
more options on the IIe side.

Like one example... I've found hard disk emulators for the IIe, and even
just plain SCSI cards... but haven't found one for the //c (though have
found disk emulators).

Were there any HD's or HD emulators or even just SCSI controllers for the
//c?

--- RATSoft/FIDO v09.14.95 [JetMail 1.01]
* Origin: STar Fleet HQ - Real Atari! bbs.sfhqbbs.org:5983 (21:3/171.0)

Like one example... I've found hard disk emulators for the IIe, and even just plain SCSI cards... but haven't found one for the //c (though have found disk emulators).

Were there any HD's or HD emulators or even just SCSI controllers for the //c?

Ponder, there were smartport HD's from Apple. Not sure if they were
applicable to the //c off hand, size would've been right though, only in the order of 20Mb that I recall.

There were other HD possibilities, they all were replacements for the
internal floppy drive, with a daughterboard to plug into the mobo. Don't
ever remember seeing SCSI for a //c though.

You can play with the cabling in the //c and swap the internal drive to be drive 2, and use a floppulator on the external port as drive 1.

Spec


*** THE READER V4.50 [freeware]
--- SuperBBS v1.17-3 (Eval)
* Origin: A camel is a horse designed by a committee. (21:3/101)

I had a couple of Apple IIs and a few of the older Macs but all that
stuff went away when I moved in with my wife who was my gf back then... I
could only keep my Atari 8-bit stuff and I had a lot of that!

--- RATSoft/FIDO v09.14.95 [JetMail 1.01]
* Origin: STar Fleet HQ - Real Atari! bbs.sfhqbbs.org:5983 (21:3/171.0)

On 22 Aug 23 23:48:56 Bf2K+ wrote...

I had a couple of Apple IIs and a few of the older Macs but all that
stuff went away when I moved in with my wife who was my gf back
then... I could only keep my Atari 8-bit stuff and I had a lot of
that!

To which Commodore Clifford replies...

Man... that kinda stinks. Did you do much BBSing with them, or was it
all about the games?

--- RATSoft/FIDO v09.14.95 [JetMail 1.01]
* Origin: STar Fleet HQ - Real Atari! bbs.sfhqbbs.org:5983 (21:3/171.0)

On 23 Aug 23 19:56:22 Commodore Clifford wrote...

On 22 Aug 23 23:48:56 Bf2K+ wrote...

I had a couple of Apple IIs and a few of the older Macs but all
that stuff went away when I moved in with my wife who was my gf
back then... I could only keep my Atari 8-bit stuff and I had a
lot of that!

To which Commodore Clifford replies...

Man... that kinda stinks. Did you do much BBSing with them, or was
it all about the games?

--- RATSoft/FIDO v09.14.95 [JetMail 1.01] * Origin: STar Fleet HQ -
Real Atari! bbs.sfhqbbs.org:5983 (21:3/171.0)

To which Bf2K+ replies...

Everything but the Ataris were in boxes... so no BBSing or anything with
the Apples or <Commodores> - I had those too.

Games? C'mon man... I thought you knew me better. :)

--- RATSoft/FIDO v09.14.95 [JetMail 1.01]
* Origin: STar Fleet HQ - Real Atari! bbs.sfhqbbs.org:5983 (21:3/171.0)

On 24 Aug 23 13:49:28 Bf2K+ wrote...

Everything but the Ataris were in boxes... so no BBSing or anything
with the Apples or <Commodores> - I had those too.

Games? C'mon man... I thought you knew me better. :)

To which Commodore Clifford replies...

Well, yeah but... Now I'm finding out you dabbled in the black arts with
Apple and Commodore, so it's like I don't even know you anymore!

--- RATSoft/FIDO v09.14.95 [JetMail 1.01]
* Origin: STar Fleet HQ - Real Atari! bbs.sfhqbbs.org:5983 (21:3/171.0)

On 24 Aug 23 14:09:10 Commodore Clifford wrote...

On 24 Aug 23 13:49:28 Bf2K+ wrote...

Everything but the Ataris were in boxes... so no BBSing or
anything with the Apples or <Commodores> - I had those too.

Games? C'mon man... I thought you knew me better. :)

To which Commodore Clifford replies...

Well, yeah but... Now I'm finding out you dabbled in the black arts
with Apple and Commodore, so it's like I don't even know you anymore!

--- RATSoft/FIDO v09.14.95 [JetMail 1.01] * Origin: STar Fleet HQ -
Real Atari! bbs.sfhqbbs.org:5983 (21:3/171.0)

To which Bf2K+ replies...

In my case, dabbling is a strong word. I owned them... that's about it.

--- RATSoft/FIDO v09.14.95 [JetMail 1.01]
* Origin: STar Fleet HQ - Real Atari! bbs.sfhqbbs.org:5983 (21:3/171.0)

On 24 Aug 23 14:17:32 Bf2K+ wrote...

In my case, dabbling is a strong word. I owned them... that's about
it.

To which Commodore Clifford replies...

Fair 'nuff. :)

--- RATSoft/FIDO v09.14.95 [JetMail 1.01]
* Origin: STar Fleet HQ - Real Atari! bbs.sfhqbbs.org:5983 (21:3/171.0)