• FsxNET Web Archive

    From shinobi@21:1/153 to All on Tue Apr 3 18:07:39 2018
    Hello All,

    I wonder. Is it a good idea to publish FsxNET Archive on World Wide Wait?
    I just went that path:
    http://infolinka.vzdelavani.eu/fsxnet

    But I want to know whether there is anyone who wouldn't like to see it.
    I can deleted it just right immediately. I didn't submit it to any search engine nor it's finished.

    But I'd like to start discussion whether anyone would object.

    Thanks & best regards

    Shinobi

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  • From Al@21:4/106 to shinobi on Tue Apr 3 12:47:46 2018
    Re: FsxNET Web Archive
    By: shinobi to All on Tue Apr 03 2018 06:07 pm

    But I'd like to start discussion whether anyone would object.

    I don't object.. but then I have nothing to object too.. :)

    Those messages almost look like a telnet session.. well done.

    Ttyl :-),
    Al


    ... Oh, I almost forgot . . . It's absolutley VITAL to insta
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  • From apam@21:1/125 to shinobi on Wed Apr 4 11:09:05 2018
    But I'd like to start discussion whether anyone would object.

    I don't really like the idea of the discussion being indexed by google.
    I'd rather keep BBS chat on BBSes.

    Andrew

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  • From esc@21:2/142 to shinobi on Wed Apr 4 02:47:43 2018
    I wonder. Is it a good idea to publish FsxNET Archive on World Wide Wait? I just went that path:
    http://infolinka.vzdelavani.eu/fsxnet

    It is not a good idea. You're taking a consolidated small network of interconnected message systems, each with authentication requirements, and
    some modicum of a private community, and you're gating it out to the open internet.

    I think doing this and asking later if it's cool is pretty aggressive.

    But I want to know whether there is anyone who wouldn't like to see it.
    I can deleted it just right immediately. I didn't submit it to any search engine nor it's finished.

    That's not how search engines work. They index stuff whether you want them to or not. I don't think you understand what you're talking about.

    But I'd like to start discussion whether anyone would object.

    *Raises hand* I object. And I doubly object to the fact that you did this without asking first. It's kind of a betrayal of trust, in my opinion, in a community that expects a modicum of trust.

    I'd advocate for a "No gating to the open internet" type of rule moving forward.

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  • From Ktulu@21:2/122 to esc on Wed Apr 4 00:24:21 2018
    It is not a good idea. You're taking a consolidated small network of interconnected message systems, each with authentication requirements,
    and some modicum of a private community, and you're gating it out to the open internet.

    I think doing this and asking later if it's cool is pretty aggressive.

    I couldn't agree anymore with you. This was a bad move and I ask that shinobi immediately take that site down.
    But I want to know whether there is anyone who wouldn't like to see i I can deleted it just right immediately. I didn't submit it to any se engine nor it's finished.

    Shinobi should delete the page right away! And as mean as this may sound so should your access to this network because of this. Just my opinion.

    He is no longer welcome on the irc network that we've formed. After this move he's probably capturing everythng on there and gating it to the internet.

    I'd advocate for a "No gating to the open internet" type of rule moving forward.

    I think Avon could put this somewhere in the infopack.

    |08---
    |07-|12Ktulu
    |15SysOp @ |12Insane Asylum |07BBS
    |07telnet://bbs.asylumbbs.net port 28

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  • From Avon@21:1/101 to Ktulu on Wed Apr 4 19:57:34 2018
    On 04/04/18, Ktulu pondered and said...

    I couldn't agree anymore with you. This was a bad move and I ask that shinobi immediately take that site down.

    ..and he has done this.

    Shinobi should delete the page right away! And as mean as this may sound so should your access to this network because of this. Just my opinion.

    That's your opinion and you're entitled to it. From my point of view that
    is *not* going to happen nor necessary.

    He is no longer welcome on the irc network that we've formed. After this move he's probably capturing everythng on there and gating it to the internet.

    Ouch, that's harsh IMHO. Not something I think is warranted nor
    likely accurate.

    I'd advocate for a "No gating to the open internet" type of rule movi forward.

    I think Avon could put this somewhere in the infopack.

    I'm open to something like this but I'd like to see more discussion between folks about this topic before I settle on any making changes, if any changes are indeed made.

    One thought I had was should we have an echomail area(s) that are fine to be (for want of a better word) gated to the public HTML / Usenet newsgroups / othernets etc. At least that way people posting in that space would do so knowingly.

    Best, Paul

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  • From Al@21:4/106 to Avon on Wed Apr 4 01:56:25 2018
    Re: Re: FsxNET Web Archive
    By: Avon to Ktulu on Wed Apr 04 2018 07:57 pm

    One thought I had was should we have an echomail area(s) that are fine to be (for want of a better word) gated to the public HTML / Usenet newsgroups / othernets etc. At least that way people posting in that space would do so knowingly.

    My BBS is available by telnet / rlogin / ssh / www / ftp / gopher and a couple others I forget. ;)

    It's meant to be accessible by various means not to step on anyones toes. I hope I haven't done that.

    Ttyl :-),
    Al


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  • From Avon@21:1/101 to Al on Wed Apr 4 21:14:43 2018
    On 04/04/18, Al pondered and said...

    My BBS is available by telnet / rlogin / ssh / www / ftp / gopher and a couple others I forget. ;)

    It's meant to be accessible by various means not to step on anyones
    toes. I hope I haven't done that.

    No I don't think you have, it's never been expressly stated that echomail posted in this network is not to be made available via any of the above.

    Indeed as you pointed out in fsx_gen in the case of Synchronet, sysops running the web server options can offer stock public access views available to any interested Internet connected party that wants to read things. e.g. https://goo.gl/pyy1B9

    At play here is the fact that we have various BBS software available offering people different ways of accessing the content of a BBS system. Nothing wrong in that at all. What's interesting in the above example (and not wanting to pick on Sneaky here but his was the first system I could think of) is that in this case it's not a requirement to be a logged in user of the BBS in order to access the content but rather an unlogged in user can do so.

    In my case I also offer a 'guest' login at Agency BBS so I offer something similar but it's done via a telnet connection or HtmlTerm / FTelnet
    enabled web interface, not as a generated (and more spider index crawler bot friendly) HTML page.

    Best, Paul

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  • From Vk3jed@21:1/109 to Avon on Wed Apr 4 19:18:00 2018
    Avon wrote to Ktulu <=-

    On 04/04/18, Ktulu pondered and said...

    I couldn't agree anymore with you. This was a bad move and I ask that shinobi immediately take that site down.

    ..and he has done this.

    Yes.

    Shinobi should delete the page right away! And as mean as this may sound so should your access to this network because of this. Just my opinion.

    That's your opinion and you're entitled to it. From my point of view
    that is *not* going to happen nor necessary.

    I agree with you Paul, there was an innocent error in judgement. He's learned his lesson, nothing further needs to be done, other than reassure him he's welcome here.

    He is no longer welcome on the irc network that we've formed. After this move he's probably capturing everythng on there and gating it to the internet.

    Ouch, that's harsh IMHO. Not something I think is warranted nor
    likely accurate.

    Again, I agree, way over the top. Do we really want to look like Fidonet?

    I'd advocate for a "No gating to the open internet" type of rule movi forward.

    I think Avon could put this somewhere in the infopack.

    I'm open to something like this but I'd like to see more discussion between folks about this topic before I settle on any making changes,
    if any changes are indeed made.

    Maybe a word about gating or releasing contents of the message network should not be released outside of FSXnet or gated, without your express permission? (which presumably would come after a group discussion). There is precedent. Ages ago, you allopwed me to gate FSX_CRY to a private mailing list (i.e. used only by me), so I could more easily participate in encryption experiments.

    One thought I had was should we have an echomail area(s) that are fine
    to be (for want of a better word) gated to the public HTML / Usenet newsgroups / othernets etc. At least that way people posting in that
    space would do so knowingly.

    Good idea Paul - FSX_PUB? :)


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  • From Vk3jed@21:1/109 to Al on Wed Apr 4 19:19:00 2018
    Al wrote to Avon <=-

    My BBS is available by telnet / rlogin / ssh / www / ftp / gopher and a couple others I forget. ;)

    That's pretty standard with Synchronet. :)


    ... Ya know, some days life is just one non sequitur after catfish.
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  • From Al@21:4/106 to Vk3jed on Wed Apr 4 02:49:30 2018
    Re: Re: FsxNET Web Archive
    By: Vk3jed to Al on Wed Apr 04 2018 07:19 pm

    My BBS is available by telnet / rlogin / ssh / www / ftp / gopher
    and a couple others I forget. ;)

    That's pretty standard with Synchronet. :)

    Yep, it is. I use my own BBS (and others too) with telnet mostly so I don't think of the other options a lot. But that is an impressive list.. :)

    Ttyl :-),
    Al


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  • From Al@21:4/106 to Avon on Wed Apr 4 03:20:05 2018
    On 04/04/18, Al pondered and said...

    My BBS is available by telnet / rlogin / ssh / www / ftp / gopher and a couple others I forget. ;)

    It's meant to be accessible by various means not to step on anyones toes. I hope I haven't done that.

    No I don't think you have, it's never been expressly stated that echomail posted in this network is not to be made available via any of the above.

    Indeed as you pointed out in fsx_gen in the case of Synchronet, sysops running the web server options can offer stock public access views available to any interested Internet connected party that wants to read things. e.g. https://goo.gl/pyy1B9

    Yeah, that's just what it looks like. I am replying from the web interface of my BBS now. As a guest user I don't have the option to reply or post new but once I log on I do.

    A user on the web interface could also create an account on the BBS from there and post if they wanted to.

    At play here is the fact that we have various BBS software available offering people different ways of accessing the content of a BBS system. Nothing wrong in that at all. What's interesting in the above example (and not wanting to pick on Sneaky here but his was the first system I could think of) is that in this case it's not a requirement to be a logged in user of the BBS in order to access the content but rather an unlogged in user can do so.

    Another time a web interface is useful is when you are visiting somewhere and have no access to a terminal you can almost always access the web.

    In my case I also offer a 'guest' login at Agency BBS so I offer something similar but it's done via a telnet connection or HtmlTerm / FTelnet
    enabled web interface, not as a generated (and more spider index crawler bot friendly) HTML page.

    That's handy too.. I used the guest account on your BBS not to long ago when I couldn't remember my password.. :)

    Ttyl :-),
    Al
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  • From Geo@21:4/124 to Vk3jed on Wed Apr 4 22:12:00 2018
    Re: Re: FsxNET Web Archive
    By: Vk3jed to Al on Wed Apr 04 2018 19:19:00

    Al wrote to Avon <=-

    My BBS is available by telnet / rlogin / ssh / www / ftp / gopher and a couple others I forget. ;)

    That's pretty standard with Synchronet. :)


    ... Ya know, some days life is just one non sequitur after catfish.
    === MultiMail/Win32 v0.49


    Yep, in fact I only just realized it myself!

    I have now made the Guest on my BBS lvl 30 so they get very little, but they do get to see what is there, but not read anything. The web interface will now only show Guest the Sysop Notices Area.

    If someone takes the time to Register and get lvl 40 access they will See And read Dove net, FidoNet and UseNet, but not FSX NET.


    Once I Validate them to Lvl 50 they can Read and Write to their hearts content.


    Seems a more sensible structure 8-)

    Regards..Geo
    ooooOOOOoooo
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  • From Static@21:2/140 to esc on Wed Apr 4 11:43:17 2018
    On 04/04/18, esc said the following...

    I'd advocate for a "No gating to the open internet" type of rule moving forward.

    This is a common echo rule in fidonet for much of the same reasons.

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  • From shinobi@21:1/153 to Static on Wed Apr 4 16:22:48 2018

    I'd advocate for a "No gating to the open internet" type of rule movi forward.

    This is a common echo rule in fidonet for much of the same reasons.

    Well... to be honest that was one of my motivations. I mean I got inspired here:
    https://fidonet.ozzmosis.com/
    But I just got valuable experience from my experiment.
    And I'm not going to repeat the same mistake again.
    After all I'm glad for the privacy FsxNET provides.

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  • From g00r00@21:1/108 to apam on Wed Apr 4 03:17:11 2018
    But I'd like to start discussion whether anyone would object.

    I don't really like the idea of the discussion being indexed by google. I'd rather keep BBS chat on BBSes.

    I agree with this 1000%!

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  • From Vk3jed@21:1/109 to Geo on Thu Apr 5 08:18:00 2018
    Geo wrote to Vk3jed <=-

    I have now made the Guest on my BBS lvl 30 so they get very little, but they do get to see what is there, but not read anything. The web
    interface will now only show Guest the Sysop Notices Area.

    My guest is level 10, normal users are 25. :)

    If someone takes the time to Register and get lvl 40 access they will
    See And read Dove net, FidoNet and UseNet, but not FSX NET.


    Once I Validate them to Lvl 50 they can Read and Write to their hearts content.

    Cool. :)


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  • From Vk3jed@21:1/109 to Al on Thu Apr 5 09:26:00 2018
    Al wrote to Avon <=-

    Yeah, that's just what it looks like. I am replying from the web
    interface of my BBS now. As a guest user I don't have the option to
    reply or post new but once I log on I do.

    A user on the web interface could also create an account on the BBS
    from there and post if they wanted to.

    On Synchronet, that's true. For some of my message networks, I encourage creation of an account via the web for people who prefer web interfaces.

    Another time a web interface is useful is when you are visiting
    somewhere and have no access to a terminal you can almost always access the web.

    Yes, done that on my own BBS before. :)

    In my case I also offer a 'guest' login at Agency BBS so I offer something similar but it's done via a telnet connection or HtmlTerm / FTelnet
    enabled web interface, not as a generated (and more spider index crawler bot friendly) HTML page.

    That's handy too.. I used the guest account on your BBS not to long ago when I couldn't remember my password.. :)

    Yep. :D


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