I am not sure how to fix that, either.

Paper only. In person, except for absentee voting with all the restrictions around it. Voting only 1 day and all votes counted in each precinct that day.

They were stuffing paper ballots, so how does that help? There are areas
where they cheated long before COVID and multiple day voting.

I agree, none of the electronic touch-screen machines, but those old
tabulating machines we used to use (pull lever) worked here great, and were a lot faster than the touch-screens.

Also, some folks seem to think "paper only and hand counting only" will fix
it. There is no way they'd get them all counted "that day" that way, and
there is no way you'd convince someone like me that someone hand-counting
it will somehow be less biased than a machine. After all, the machine is biased because of how a *person* programmed it.

I don't want Florida 2000 every four years. That'd be even worse than what
we have now.

In person is good. One vote per person is good. Each ballot only able to
be counted once is good. The only way you can enforce those last two, especially the last one, is if a machine counts them. If a code on the
ballot has already been scanned and successfully counted once, throw an
error that requires someone to actually confront the person right then who's trying to stuff the ballot back in again.

I would go as far as to say the ballot should expire after X amount of
time. That way it cannot easily leave the polling location and come back later, and it cannot be pulled back out from under a table and rescanned
later. Where we poll, the line is before the ballot is printed. Once it
is printed, you are able to start voting right them so there should be very little wait. Give someone X time to fill it out and put it in the scanner, from the time it is printed and handed to them, or force them to start over.

Part of the reason I like the idea of multiple days is that it keeps places like Leftistexcrementholeville from claiming that people don't have enough
time to vote and trying to keep the polls open past 6pm on Election night.
They used to complain all the time. The procedures we have now prevent
them from doing so, so no keeping the polls open until they get the numbers they want.

I would be very leary of some national-level requirements

Those requirements are unconstutional on their face.

Agreed, which means it would be difficult to get certain states (see below)
or even certain regions of certain states (Chicago, NYC) to agree to
anything that would prevent tampering.

because we both know the current
administration would have all the states allowing all sorts of stupid stuff.

As well as Blue states.

That is the "see below" from above. ;)

You should be able to sort the little cards from 0-X and see if someone's missing or duplicated. You should be able to sort the ballots from 0-(Y+Z) an
see if a ballot is missing. And, of course X should equal Y.

Oh, but math is racist.

That'd never fly in Oregon, for example, for that reason.

Our paper ballots go into a locked machine. I don't know if it tabulates
it or not at that moment, but it tells us that our ballot has been accepted.

I would rather them not tabulate, or at least not be able to tell anyone
what was tabulated, until after 6pm Election night. On the other hand, it could be handy if it gave the voter a receipt that told them what their
ballot was counted as... although I see a lot of confusion and people
claiming it was wrong when it really wasn't if it could do that.


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Mike Powell wrote to Dr. What <=-

They were stuffing paper ballots, so how does that help? There are
areas where they cheated long before COVID and multiple day voting.

It's harder to stuff real paper, that's been filled out, than to flip bits.

It won't fix the problem, but it will reduce the impact of cheating. Look at the amount of cheating that needed to be done in 2020 to pull Sleepy Joe across the finish line. From a logistics point of view, if you constrain voting enough, you can't stuff enough paper ballots to get your candidate to win.

I agree, none of the electronic touch-screen machines, but those old tabulating machines we used to use (pull lever) worked here great, and were a lot faster than the touch-screens.

Yup. But they can also be "programmed" to cheat as well.

Also, some folks seem to think "paper only and hand counting only" will fix it. There is no way they'd get them all counted "that day" that
way,

Sure there is. They don't bring all the ballots to a central place and count them. They count them at every precinct. Parallel processing at its finest. If a precinct is too large to count, they need to break it up.

and there is no way you'd convince someone like me that someone hand-counting it will somehow be less biased than a machine. After
all, the machine is biased because of how a *person* programmed it.

The problem is that it's easy to produce a bunch of machines to cheat. It's much harder to produce a bunch of people who will cheat.

In person is good. One vote per person is good. Each ballot only able
to be counted once is good. The only way you can enforce those last
two, especially the last one, is if a machine counts them.

Only if the code is open source, vetted as correct, and the machines are completely disconnected from any ability to change after loaded with the software. Hm.... I just realized that we do almost all of this with electronic payment devices that stores use to read your credit card.

I would go as far as to say the ballot should expire after X amount of time. That way it cannot easily leave the polling location and come
back later, and it cannot be pulled back out from under a table and rescanned later.

But this is how the machines were designed. They were designed to allow for cheating.

Currently, I do not trust **any** current machine to tabulate ballots.

Part of the reason I like the idea of multiple days is that it keeps places like Leftistexcrementholeville from claiming that people don't
have enough time to vote and trying to keep the polls open past 6pm on Election night. They used to complain all the time.

Does anyone listen to those ignorants? They are the same ones who keep pushing the false Narrative that "Blacks can't get IDs to vote."

Polls are open long enough for nearly everyone to be able to vote in person. For the outliars, we have mail in voting.

Our paper ballots go into a locked machine. I don't know if it
tabulates it or not at that moment, but it tells us that our ballot has been accepted.

In my area, it's a locked box. About the only thing it does it verify that the ballot is not spoiled (i.e. you voted for 2 candidates when you were only allowed to vote for 1).

I would rather them not tabulate, or at least not be able to tell
anyone what was tabulated, until after 6pm Election night. On the
other hand, it could be handy if it gave the voter a receipt that told them what their ballot was counted as... although I see a lot of
confusion and people claiming it was wrong when it really wasn't if it could do that.

I thought about that. Sort of like getting a paper receipt at the store. But instead of giving it to the voter, it goes in to a separate locked box to be used only if they needed to audit the vote.

But now we are back to all the problem surrounding paper ballots.

There's no perfect solution to this. About all we can do is make voter fraud not worth the effort.


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and there is no way you'd convince someone like me that someone hand-counting it will somehow be less biased than a machine. After
all, the machine is biased because of how a *person* programmed it.

The problem is that it's easy to produce a bunch of machines to cheat. It's much harder to produce a bunch of people who will cheat.

I don't think so. For local elections, yes, but you honestly don't think
they could find plenty of Never-Trumpers in electoral-vote rich states?

Just here locally I think they could find enough Never-Republicans in Leftyexcrementholeville to fix state-level election results here, especially
if their dead start voting again. There, it might be harder to find
someone who could program the machine to do it for them as most of those
types there are probably not smart enough.

In person is good. One vote per person is good. Each ballot only able to be counted once is good. The only way you can enforce those last two, especially the last one, is if a machine counts them.

Only if the code is open source, vetted as correct, and the machines are completely disconnected from any ability to change after loaded with the software. Hm.... I just realized that we do almost all of this with electronic payment devices that stores use to read your credit card.

Yep. Now you see some of what I am thinking.

I would go as far as to say the ballot should expire after X amount of time. That way it cannot easily leave the polling location and come back later, and it cannot be pulled back out from under a table and rescanned later.

But this is how the machines were designed. They were designed to allow for cheating.

Currently, I do not trust **any** current machine to tabulate ballots.

I don't know that they were designed to allow for it specifically, but if I
can program the machine to tabulate a choice of X as a vote for Y, on
purpose or by accident, it is not designed to NOT allow it, which it should be.

You can honestly mis-map a screen, but I would expect then that all choices
of Y would also turn into votes for X. I have never heard of that
happening. Have you?

Part of the reason I like the idea of multiple days is that it keeps places like Leftistexcrementholeville from claiming that people don't have enough time to vote and trying to keep the polls open past 6pm on Election night. They used to complain all the time.

Does anyone listen to those ignorants? They are the same ones who keep pushin
the false Narrative that "Blacks can't get IDs to vote."

Yes. Some major cities nationally, pre COVID, had extended hours beyond
the rest of their state (which makes it special treatment). I don't know
if Leftyexcrementholeville was ever successful in convincing Kentucky to
allow them to do so, though.

Polls are open long enough for nearly everyone to be able to vote in person. For the outliars, we have mail in voting.

I like mail-in even less than multilple day in-person. Although illegal, I could have received and mailed-in three ballots during the 2020 primary as,
at the time, there were somehow two extra people registered at this address (one dead, one long moved out of state) who were offered a chance to
receive a ballot.

I could not have voted three times in person, even with multiple days to do
it, because I only have one ID and ID is required here.

Expiring ballots, proper identification, and "one person, one vote" verifications would fix most issues.

Our paper ballots go into a locked machine. I don't know if it tabulates it or not at that moment, but it tells us that our ballot has been accepted.

In my area, it's a locked box. About the only thing it does it verify that th
ballot is not spoiled (i.e. you voted for 2 candidates when you were only allowed to vote for 1).

That is probably all it does here also. I have never spoiled one and have never asked so I am not certain.

There's no perfect solution to this. About all we can do is make voter fraud not worth the effort.

Yes indeed.


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Mike Powell wrote to Dr. What <=-

I don't think so. For local elections, yes, but you honestly don't
think they could find plenty of Never-Trumpers in electoral-vote rich states?

Like I said, it's not 100%. It's simply harder.

Case in point: in the last election in Detroit, the Elitists committed crimes to push Republican Observers away from the process so that they couldn't see the cheating.

So even in an Elitist run precinct, there are good people who can, and will, blow the whistle.

Sadly, our AG is an Elitist and refused to do anything about it even though there is piles of evidence.

I don't know that they were designed to allow for it specifically,

Yes. That was the basis of the lawsuits against the MyPillow guy. The manufacturers of the machines didn't like him saying the truth, so they sued him. And now that the research is done, we have proof that the machines were designed to facilitate cheating.

Of course that's not a surprise. Venesuela uses the same machines.

You can honestly mis-map a screen, but I would expect then that all choices of Y would also turn into votes for X. I have never heard of
that happening. Have you?

No. The cheating was more subtle. If every X vote was Y and Y vote was X that would be really, really obvious. They need to make the election process seem like we have a choice.

What the machines did was flip some votes. Ex: If Biden was winning in that area, the machine did nothing. But if Biden was losing, the machine would flip **some** votes to keep Biden in the lead.

BTW: This is why they closed the tabulation process early (or made up "emergencies" to close down for the night). The algorithm in the machines couldn't keep Biden in the lead.

An analysis of the votes in some places here in Michigan showed that this was the case.

I like mail-in even less than multilple day in-person.

When I say "mail in voting", I'm talking about the process that's been in place for a long time. I show up at the city office and explain my need (i.e. I will be out of state that day), then show my ID, and I am given a ballot that I can fill out and mail in.

Yes, there are problems with that process. Like I said, nothing's 100%. But 1. There is a record that I have a mail in vote.
2. If I attempt to vote on election day, that will be flagged, since they know I asked for a mail in vote.

Again, much harder to cheat. And if you have an Elitist run state (like Michigan), the Sec of State will ignore the law and set her own election rules, and the AG will not prosecute the people who broke the laws.


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I like mail-in even less than multilple day in-person.

When I say "mail in voting", I'm talking about the process that's been in plac
for a long time. I show up at the city office and explain my need (i.e. I wil
be out of state that day), then show my ID, and I am given a ballot that I can
fill out and mail in.

Yes, the absentee process. Gotcha.

Again, much harder to cheat. And if you have an Elitist run state (like Michigan), the Sec of State will ignore the law and set her own election rules
and the AG will not prosecute the people who broke the laws.

Our SOS race was the only one I really cared much about this time around,
and we retained ours. He is very good at what he does.


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