I'm always curious as to what people's *nix choice is. With such a variety of distros out there, getting peoples perspectives is always a learning experience.

Myself:

For headless server style systems that don't require X or a window manager I always go with the granddaddy: Debian.

If I do need a GUI environment to work in, I usually run Linux Mint.

frank // netsurge
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I'm always curious as to what people's *nix choice is. With such a
variety of distros out there, getting peoples perspectives is always
a learning experience.

If I'm using linux, generally openSUSE.

My favorite is either NetBSD or OpenIndiana. I've always had a soft spot
for Sun, and I don't know why NetBSD, I just like it :)

Andrew

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My favorite is either NetBSD or OpenIndiana. I've always had a soft spot for Sun, and I don't know why NetBSD, I just like it :)

I must admit, I use FreeBSD here and there, especially when I want a hardened rock solid system such as a dedicated choke routing unit or file server. You really can't beat it.

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On 23 Jun 2019, Netsurge said the following...

I'm always curious as to what people's *nix choice is. With such a
variety of distros out there, getting peoples perspectives is always a learning experience.

I am pretty new using nix for myself and stumbled across Xubuntu as a lightweight flavor to run under VM for Mystic.

I really like it -- I know it's not like a lot of the classics many of you
are used to (or that's what I have read) but for me as a newcomer it's been nothing been fantastic.

For work we use Red Hat managed all via SSH which works great for that but nothing exciting.

So do not have much to compare against -- it's a little overwhelming the different flavors out there and I like to stick with something once it works unless there is a strong specific reason to switch to something new to try.

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LockeDown (Mickey Frklic)
[mysticisland.strangled.net]

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I am pretty new using nix for myself and stumbled across Xubuntu as a lightweight flavor to run under VM for Mystic.

I really like it -- I know it's not like a lot of the classics many of
you are used to (or that's what I have read) but for me as a newcomer
it's been nothing been fantastic.

For work we use Red Hat managed all via SSH which works great for that
but nothing exciting.

So do not have much to compare against -- it's a little overwhelming the different flavors out there and I like to stick with something once it works unless there is a strong specific reason to switch to something
new to try.

They all pretty much do the same thing and can run the same software, that is definitely a bonus.

I've been using Debain since version 3 (a long time ago) and have never
really needed to venture off, especially when it is running headless as
running any other *nix variation headless would be the same.

Distros that are Ubuntu based and many others are all based on Debian. That
is why I like Linux Mint, it too is Debian based but unlike Ubuntu, there is
no bloat. Working in it and moving around it is just like Debian.

In todays age, linux distros are pretty much all the same. Long go the days
of compiling gentoo from source just so you could squeeze out a few more cpu cycles out of your 486. Now that hardware and processors are as powerful as they are, anything you run will be fast. This way whatever you are
comfortable using will be just as fast and powerful as the next distro (with
a few exceptions of course).

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I'm always curious as to what people's *nix choice is. With such a
variety of distros out there, getting peoples perspectives is always a learning experience.

I use arch for home computing and typically use debian for headless servers, though lately I've started using ubuntu. Debian's predictable release-when-ready scheme has worked really well for me in the past, but I've always hankered for some newer packages and have been reluctant to jump to testing or sid or run some kind of hodgepodge backport thing. So, giving
ubuntu a shot...so far so good :)

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I use arch for home computing and typically use debian for headless servers, though lately I've started using ubuntu. Debian's predictable release-when-ready scheme has worked really well for me in the past, but I've always hankered for some newer packages and have been reluctant to jump to testing or sid or run some kind of hodgepodge backport thing.
So, giving ubuntu a shot...so far so good :)

Ubuntu is definitely the way to go if you want to use the latest and greatest without the need to pin packages.

frank // netsurge
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Ubuntu is definitely the way to go if you want to use the latest and greatest without the need to pin packages.

On the flip side, I feel like packages update as frequently as arch, so every day I wake up immediately out of date. It's a tradeoff, I suppose...

There's also increased server downtime due to reboots to pick up new kernels.
I read the phoronix changelog to see _how_ necessary it is; if it isn't security related (particularly in a way that I find to be a potential vulnerability for my use case) I'll punt the update as long as possible.

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Re: Favorite Flavour
By: Netsurge to All on Sun Jun 23 2019 12:52 am

I'm always curious as to what people's *nix choice is. With such a variety of distros out there, getting peoples perspectives is always a learning experience.

I've tried A LOT of different distros (and alternative OS's.)

For the past few years I've pretty much been on Ubuntu. It works great as a server and has lots of support (almost any problem can be solved with a Google search.)

I'm really into LXC/LXD containers lately. Have quite a few running around the house performing different tasks. Makes management of them a breeze. On a production server hosting some web sites, I've even converted some old virtual hosts into their own containers to increase isolation. If I need to, I can easily dup them onto other servers and tell HAProxy there are multiple instances and to load balance between them.

For a desktop though, I'm using Win10. Haven't had the need yet to install Linux on it (will probably play around with the new version of Windows Linux services when they release the newest version.)
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On 23 Jun 2019, ryan said the following...

I use arch for home computing and typically use debian for headless servers, though lately I've started using ubuntu. Debian's predictable release-when-ready scheme has worked really well for me in the past, but I've always hankered for some newer packages and have been reluctant to jump to testing or sid or run some kind of hodgepodge backport thing.
So, giving ubuntu a shot...so far so good :)

I've been using Ubuntu for about 2 years now, and have really liked it. I am, however, looking at probably changing over to Debian in the near future. The main reason, Ubuntu seems to be dedicated to changing over to snap packages. I've tried installing some programs with snap, and haven't had any luck with them, so I don't know if it's me, or something with snap...

There is a lot of bloat in Ubuntu that I really don't need, so perhaps a
Debian install would be the best bet for me...


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On the flip side, I feel like packages update as frequently as arch, so every day I wake up immediately out of date. It's a tradeoff, I
suppose...

This is why I prefer Debian. Solid stable releases only. It takes a while before a new version gets pushed, unless it is a security update of course.

frank // netsurge
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There is a lot of bloat in Ubuntu that I really don't need, so perhaps a Debian install would be the best bet for me...

Start the debian install with nothing more than openssh-server, nice and
learn. Then you build from there.

frank // netsurge
disksh0p!bbs // bbs.diskshop.ca // mystic goodness
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On 23 Jun 2019, Netsurge said the following...

There is a lot of bloat in Ubuntu that I really don't need, so perhap Debian install would be the best bet for me...

Start the debian install with nothing more than openssh-server, nice and learn. Then you build from there.

I had it installed on a laptop here that I was playing around with. I liked
the look and feel of it. I just hope that Debian doesn't decide to make the move to snap...


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I had it installed on a laptop here that I was playing around with. I liked the look and feel of it. I just hope that Debian doesn't decide to make the move to snap...

Snap is a 100% Canonical project. I don't think there is anything to fear on that front. I think the guys at Debian are quite happy with their deb system.

I really think this is just Canonical finally trying to stand on their own
two feet. Personally I think it is a bad idea. Snap seems to be causing havoc in the Ubuntu community.

frank // netsurge
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There is a lot of bloat in Ubuntu that I really don't need, so perhaps a Debian install would be the best bet for me...

Yeah, agreed, though in server/headless mode this isn't the case. I actually use Ubuntu as a server and not desktop, so in my case, all is good. It runs about as lightweight as a debian server, in my experience.

Snap is terrible. And so is removing 32 bit support. I may have to rethink Ubuntu moving forward...fortunately Mystic is easy to move from server to server. *shrug*

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On 24 Jun 2019, Netsurge said the following...

Snap is a 100% Canonical project. I don't think there is anything to
fear on that front. I think the guys at Debian are quite happy with
their deb system.

I am also very happy with the deb system. I think it works great.

I really think this is just Canonical finally trying to stand on their
own two feet. Personally I think it is a bad idea. Snap seems to be causing havoc in the Ubuntu community.

At this point, Canonical is going to hurt themselves more than help with
snap. It doesn't work, and it's a security issue.

My biggest concern is third party developers not creating deb packages
anymore, but moving over to snap. I've already seen that happen with
Notepadqq. I'm sure others will follow... sigh...


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Re: Favorite Flavour
By: Netsurge to All on Sun Jun 23 2019 12:52 am

I'm always curious as to what people's *nix choice is. With such a variety of distros out there, getting peoples perspectives is always a learning experience.

Well, that depends, for me anyway. ;)

I run my BBS on CentOS 7 because I compile my BBS software from rpm .spec files so I can more easily maintain it, upgrade it, etc. Even Synchronet BBS itself I've developed a .spec that pulls from CVS to compile everything into split packages of synchronet-*.rpm, splitting each optional xtrn (door/js) into their own package.

For servers, I run Debian and CentOS. Somewhat more preferring Debian for them because of how they set things up in Debian is just cleaner overall, but for security situations I use CentOS since I also know how to manage SELinux properly. :)

For Desktops, hmmm.. That is still a toss-up. I really really like Fedora, and their upgrade process with dnf has made things very nice. However, I'd used Linux Mint, and while it is kinda nice, it's not without its issues. The Cinnamon devs completely broke Cinnamon for me to the point use of it anymore is just unreasonable to me. The taskbar creates phantom entries that never go away until rebooting/relogging, so lately I've been using Xubuntu on my laptop, while Linux Mint remains on my desktop, so far.

To be fair, I absolutely hate the .deb package system/format in general, though. It's the most painful to maintain and manage than any other packaging format there is, so in that respect, I definitely prefer Fedora for when I maintain my own packages (Which, I do, for SyncTERM at least). But Steam seems to work best with Ubuntu, so I've been using Xubuntu because XFCE is the last DE that I can actually seem to stand that doesn't crash and burn like the others.

So, what's my favorite desktop Linux distro? Fedora, hands down. Server?
Debian and CentOS.

)))[Psi-Jack -//- Decker]
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Re: Re: Favorite Flavour
By: ryan to Black Panther on Mon Jun 24 2019 06:09 am

There is a lot of bloat in Ubuntu that I really don't need, so
perhaps a Debian install would be the best bet for me...

Yeah, agreed, though in server/headless mode this isn't the case. I actually use Ubuntu as a server and not desktop, so in my case, all is good. It runs about as lightweight as a debian server, in my experience.

Snap is terrible. And so is removing 32 bit support. I may have to rethink Ubuntu moving forward...fortunately Mystic is easy to move from server to server. *shrug*

Ugh... If I use anything "universal" I'll use FlatPak, but I much prefer native packages for the distro more than anything because of space consumption, compatability, and nativity.

Think about it though. Canonical made upstart. Horrible thing that was. It got widely adopted, but seldom actually used. (Debian, CentOS, Fedora, openSUSE, all adopted it, but minimally used it). Why? Because it had issues during the development of an upstart "event", that it would crash and burn and stop working, until you rebooted. Unity was another thing Canonical made.... Ubuntu One.... Where do you think Snaps are headed? ;)

)))[Psi-Jack -//- Decker]
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So, what's my favorite desktop Linux distro? Fedora, hands down. Server? Debian and CentOS.

You make some great points.

I used RedHat for years and still have a place for it in my heart. I moved to Debian when they released version 3 and have never really looked back.

I'm really indifferent to deb's, they have always worked for me. I do prefer
to compile my own software from source as I really like to control what goes where and what can do what.

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Re: Re: Favorite Flavour
By: Netsurge to Psi-Jack on Wed Jul 17 2019 08:32 pm

So, what's my favorite desktop Linux distro? Fedora, hands down.
Server? Debian and CentOS.

You make some great points.

Well, I've been around quite a while. MS-DOS, OS/2, Windows, macOS, Linux, etc. ;) But I've stuck primarily to Linux, and been involved in the Linux world and communuties for longer than most. You could say I literally have forgotten more Linux than most people will ever learn in their lifetimes. :)

)))[Psi-Jack -//- Decker]
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Re: Re: Favorite Flavour
By: Netsurge to Psi-Jack on Wed Jul 17 2019 08:32 pm

I used RedHat for years and still have a place for it in my heart. I moved to Debian when they released version 3 and have never really looked back.

I'm really indifferent to deb's, they have always worked for me. I do prefer to compile my own software from source as I really like to control what goes where and what can do what.

Woops. /s'd that too quickly. LOL

.deb's themselves are not the problem. It's defining how to build source into a .deb package that's, to me, the actual problem. I've decided if I'm ever going to make .deb packages ever again is by using the FPM (F'kin Package Manager), because the debian/{control, rules, changelog, etc...}, files. This is where rpm has a good idea of a single .spec file and a src.rpm file that contains all the Source# files related to it that extracts into $HOME/rpmbuild/ appropriately. Even fancier, on modern CentOS or Fedora, you vim a new empty .spec file, and it creates a template for you to fill out. ;)

That said, while I hate Arch as a distro because I feel the developers of it are just lazy most of the time, not wanting to package everything and leave it up to 3rd parties whom will (and have) made malicious packages, Arch's pacaging methods are pretty easy to get into. Most others BESIDES Debian's in fact, are easier to get into in general.

So, the end result package format isn't the real issue, but how to get TO that package file is the real issue. :)

)))[Psi-Jack -//- Decker]
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I'm really indifferent to deb's, they have always worked for me. I do prefer to compile my own software from source as I really like to
control what goes where and what can do what.

Perhaps you'd be interested in arch with a local AUR :)

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Re: Re: Favorite Flavour
By: ryan to Netsurge on Wed Jul 17 2019 11:52 pm

I'm really indifferent to deb's, they have always worked for me. I do prefer to compile my own software from source as I really like to control what goes where and what can do what.

Perhaps you'd be interested in arch with a local AUR :)

Crux might be a good one too, I think it's a little more BSDish type linux with a base system and a ports tree.

Andrew
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Perhaps you'd be interested in arch with a local AUR :)

I like Arch as well. Used it for a while as a desktop when I finally let
Gentoo go.

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Crux might be a good one too, I think it's a little more BSDish type
linux with a base system and a ports tree.

That is one I haven't played with yet but have heard great things from
multiple people. Once I get this stupid mega slots issue sorted out, I will
try it in a VM

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Re: Re: Favorite Flavour
By: Netsurge to Apam on Thu Jul 18 2019 06:57 am

That is one I haven't played with yet but have heard great things from multiple people. Once I get this stupid mega slots issue sorted out, I will try it in a VM

Oh dear.. is the mega slots issue more widespread than just me? Did I break it?

Andrew
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On Thursday July 18, 2019, Apam said to ryan...

Crux might be a good one too, I think it's a little more BSDish type
linux with a base system and a ports tree.

I would ultimately prefer BSD. It's mature, secure and stable, a great
platform for a BBS.

The only downside is that it won't run dosemu. As I run an interbbs league,
I really need a dos emulator that supports file locking. With all the
scripts that run to keep the games humming along, running a single process would slow things down.

frank!netsurge ! hysteriabbs.com ! zeus 1.7 ! amiga 4ooo
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Re: Re: Favorite Flavour
By: Netsurge to Apam on Tue Jul 23 2019 12:01 am

I would ultimately prefer BSD. It's mature, secure and stable, a great platform for a BBS.

The only downside is that it won't run dosemu. As I run an interbbs league, I really need a dos emulator that supports file locking. With all the scripts that run to keep the games humming along, running a single process would slow things down.

Fair enough. I'm running FreeBSD on my desktop at the moment, but there are some issues. PabloDraw segfaults a lot, some other programs don't run. I installed void linux yesterday because I wanted to play minecraft. Unfortunatly that crashed, so I'm reinstalling freebsd.

I used to really love linux, but it feels like it's lost its way a bit. Things like wayland, systemd, snap & flatpaks, they're all things that just don't seem necessary, and in some cases going backwards.. but all the distros adopt them because it's the new shiny.

And distros these days all seem to be respins, ubuntu/debian or arch or sometimes fedora. Perhaps I have rose coloured glasses on looking at the past, I don't know.

Andrew
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Fair enough. I'm running FreeBSD on my desktop at the moment, but there are some issues. PabloDraw segfaults a lot, some other programs don't
run. I installed v oid linux yesterday because I wanted to play
minecraft. Unfortunatly that crashe d, so I'm reinstalling freebsd.

I used to really love linux, but it feels like it's lost its way a bit. Things l ike wayland, systemd, snap & flatpaks, they're all things that just don't seem n ecessary, and in some cases going backwards.. but all the distros adopt them bec ause it's the new shiny.

When I need a box to server a single dedicated purpose, FreeBSD is the way to go, hands down.

I rarely use Linux as a desktop OS, I primary use OS X for day to day stuff
but run linux exclusively for all backend stuff.

As i really don't need bells and whistles, i really don't care about the hot new distro. I have been using debian for almost 20 years. Install the base system, add an ssh server and then build from there. I prefer to build what i need from source where I can and have learned to live with systemd.

What they are doing with snap and flatpack is a shame. I think there just
might be enough backlash that people will revert to tried and true options
like deb and rpms.

I guess I am just set in my ways so most of these things don't bother me, but if I had to use linux as a desktop day to day I would be livid.

I would still use linux, even with all this bullshit, over any Microsoft OS.
10 times out of 10.

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Apam wrote to Netsurge <=-

I used to really love linux, but it feels like it's lost its way
a bit. Things like wayland, systemd, snap & flatpaks, they're all
things that just don't seem necessary, and in some cases going
backwards.. but all the distros adopt them because it's the new
shiny.

Well.... not ALL the distros are doing that. My daily driver -
Slackware - certainly has none of those, and very likely never
will. There are a few others too.

And distros these days all seem to be respins, ubuntu/debian or
arch or sometimes fedora. Perhaps I have rose coloured glasses on
looking at the past, I don't know.

Not much argument with that. There is one new-ish distro that I
actually like - MX Linux. It's Debian-based but without systemd
and other nasty stuff. Seems quite nice in the limited testing
I've done with it.


... Windows 3.1 - From the people who brought you EDLIN.
=== MultiMail/Linux v0.52
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Re: Favorite Flavour
By: Netsurge to All on Sun Jun 23 2019 12:52 am

I'm always curious as to what people's *nix choice is.
With such a variety of distros out there, getting
peoples
perspectives is always a learning experience.

I manage a fleet of fedora desktop machines. I really like how fedora is bleeding edge gnome and simple for non technical users, at the same time still linux under the hood.

It being upstream from Rhel is also nice because we get some support if needed. ---
þ Synchronet þ Vertrauen þ Home of Synchronet þ [vert/cvs/bbs].synchro.net

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